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-1, mannn I thought you would have dropped making dumb suggestions when you came back. :\

There really isn't any issue to people using real world religions unless they are doing it in a mocking or offensive way. Which is why people who have done that have been punished in the past. This suggestion is mostly targeting BH and EJs as well, Jedi have the force and clones aren't religious. Regardless, the idea that people can make caricatures of religions and that's fine but not being able to roleplay as someone of that faith normally isn't? I feel like that would end up offending more people if that's what you're concerned about. Also, to provide context to the situation that lead to this. My BH is based off of Joshua Graham from Fallout New Vegas, if yall haven't played the game essentially parts of his quotes are verses from bible passages. Literally, Logic's only complaint was that one of the verses I quoted said Jerusalem in it. If I hadn't of quoted that specific line, he wouldn't of gave 2 shits. Regardless, -1. We already have sufficient rules in place. EDIT: Was not aware he was told to put this on the forums instead by Sinister. Changed statement to reflect that.

this aint the way god intended it to be -1

212th has something going for the pumpkin look

Logic, while I do believe in that sentiment too. This is not the way to go about it. You improve things by holding people accountable for their shitty behavior. This doesn’t fix anything. also, if you’re going to go on about how we as a community need to be better or talk about things being offensive.

+1. Reasoning: 1) Models look cool 2) 212th want them, and they make some sense to be added 3) It doesn’t harm anything. I’m tired of people gatekeeping others. Let ‘em have some fun and add something cool to their regiment.

So, I’ve thought about this a bit more and I have more I’d like to add. This rule is unnecessary due to the fact that people who are offensive or racist in what have you in the ways they portray a religion will be punished. Your suggestion won’t stop anything, as people who want to do islamophobic shit or be general dumbasses will still do so. We don’t tell people that they can’t fly vehicles cause minges could take them, we don’t have players weapons stripped because people may RDM in between events. Etc. you get the picture. there is 0 issue with people role playing as characters with religious themes unless they take it to far which some people have. But just because some people are dumbasses doesn’t mean we should restrict player RP, especially when it pertains to BH which is more heavily roleplay oriented. If we applied this same reasoning to other fields then you can quickly see how this is a flawed perspective.

Completely ignored what i said and just got shitty instead. -1 Waste of time.

Should we just write fanfiction to justify it like everyone else does?

Who the fuck care if someone else wants models. Bet 10 in one if it was for your battalion you would +1 in it. But if they want it then let them be my vote +1

-1

Alright, keep comments on topic and relevant to the suggestion from now on. Anything off topic will be hidden.

I think people should read up on the difference between churches, sects, and cults before they give their opinions. ESPECIALLY CULTS since people don't seem to understand them (key words to learn more: Sociological classifications of religious movements).

Bruh, Logic, you only posted this cause somebody has their BH character as Joshua Graham from Fallout New Vegas and is RPing them as they should. The point of the rules is not to be offensive. Joshua literally just talks about being a pastor and "The Lord's work must be done." In what way, shape, or form, is that offensive? -1

+1 Models look good af, I support it. Havoc Squad Models > Parjai Models. (:

Name: Logic RP Rank: Knight III Suggestion: Make it against server rules to emulate real world religions Implementation: Clarify emulating real world religions on any job is failRP because its not lore friendly, and there is a chance that can be seen as offensive, even if its not meant to be offensive. Lore: The real world does not exist within the star wars world. IMPORTANT DEFINITIONS: Emulate: to model after, to recreate, or to take DIRECT inspiration from. This includes offensive stereotypes Real World Religion: Any religion followed by anyone in the real world. Including but not limited to Christianity, Judaism, Catholicism, Islam, ETC. More In Depth Reasoning: My point is, it can VERY quickly devolve and become offensive, even if that was never the intent. Or someone can find it offensive even if not everyone interprets it as such. And to clarify, when I say emulate I mean simulating Christian, Muslim, Jewish, catholic, Mormon etc. Religions in a way that they are easily recognizable, using specific terms, characteristics or events. Example from a recent scenario: Mentioning Jerusalem in a world where Jerusalem does not exist, clearly taking characteristics from a real world religion and using it in the fictional world of starwars. Clearly emulating a Christian rooted religion. (Fuck specifics I'm no expert) If I got on a senator job and began spouting Q theories and shit people would be offended Even if I represent it in a way that is not offensive toward the people who believe that stuff Like politics, religion has no place in rp. It creates divide in a community. Yes, The Jedi Order draws inspiration from real world religion without making it super recognizable or drawing on stereotypes. There is also no reference to biblical/religious events, actions, or characters of a real world religion. Essentially making it its own religion, and manages to avoid offending anyone I don't care if you guys worship a flying bantha that turns rocks into chicken nuggets and shits skittles. But keep real world religion and politics out of it. I was told that the BH high command has no say in this, and they advised me to make a server suggestion so here it is. This suggestion is not saying the person involved in the aforementioned scenario was guilty of being offensive towards anyone. This suggestion is to implement a preventive measure to prevent a scenario like Saleem from happening again and people actually trying to justify their actions.

Appreciate the response and I'll clear some things up just to give you and possibly others a better understanding. These will by no means be the standard models Airborne/Parjai use, they'll be strictly used during missions (which ill make sure they know when and when not to use them), and by no means am i making an announcement to put these on a higher list than others. Not too sure which other battalions look bad, I personally think other battalions have some pretty sick models (Like 104th), sure some may not look entirely polished but I don't think that these models take priority. One of the biggest reasons I''m putting this back up is because they were denied due to the server not wanting to commission models; however, there was no commissioning needed to be done. The models were already made and Jayarr didn't want money. Again, I appreciate the response The mad lad himself

What 2ndAC does to a mf +1 Looks nice asf Bring back pumpkin models for GC

This sets a bit of a shaky base as to what we call "offensive". Starwars is an imitation of real life and the fantasy world. Good vs Evil. Cults. Corrupt politicians and religious members. if we bar this, where do we stop?

we'd need to define emulate as Many religions in star wars are a hodgepodge of religions and could arguably be emulating religions https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Religion#:~:text=The Force and the Jedi,%2C and Judaism—and Buddhism. -1

Star Wars doesn't exist in Real World, but Jediism is a thing. It would be entirely realistic for the possibility of something akin to modern religions popping up. "Jesus could walk on water due to the Force" type deal. Not to mention, its been shown that god like entities exist in SW. Gonna stop saying "Things don't exist" and start saying "Things aren't shown to exist". It doesn't mean they don't, it just means we don't know if they do. Havoc Squad aren't shown to exist, but we have them on the server is a good example too

That's not why it would be fail RP. I think you might to define Fail RP on the post too... However The Burned Man kinda cool and a nice quirk. Mans got pressed because someone RP'd on the server sheesh -1 mans probably named dropped Jerusalem because he messed up while improving. Mans gonna stop GM's from hosting cult events becuase the members might be offended bruh. Edit: on the census Jedi to appear across the world in english speaking countries, as peoples identified religion.

Changing my vote to a -1. As long as your "emulating" a real world religion in a respectful way I don't see a particular issue with it. If you get told to stop, then stop.

Clarifying in the rules that making fun or misrepresenting a religion is not okay is not the way to make the community more inclusive? Yes I probably should've AOS'd you for failrp quoting the bible and shit. My bad for giving you a warning first. Ok thats fair, I'll change it, I actually thought I put idiot so as not to be offensive. Guess I forgot to save it. Thank you for pointing that out @Mitchell I understand what you were doing was not offensive. However what you were doing is dragging stuff into rp that shouldn't be there. I, like many others play this server to escape my life stresses. I don't talk about much of my life to anyone on the server, maybe some anecdotes about my classes or shitty profs. Maybe a joke about how my parents used to treat me in ooc. But I genuinely come here for an escape from everything. Politics, my crazy religious ex, who is my neighbor, my dad threatening to kill my cat or some government official. I don't want any of that shit in my roleplay. What YOU were doing is already against server rules under failrp, and the reason I called it out is because of that and I'm sure theres other people who don't want to see real world religion in their roleplay while they try to escape their reality just like me. What I am suggesting is almost completely unrelated, because I KNOW you had no bad intentions. But you did bring to mind how it actually isn't against the server rules to get on a BH job and represent religions. The only reason the saleem situation ended in a racism ban is because they were also stereotyping a race. Theoretically under the current rule set anyone can get on a bh and act like a bunch of christians and begin using stereotypes to misrepresent them. Thats what this rule will prevent. And if this interupts your fallout rp then get creative with it. Instead of copying a NV character, change it up to be starwars. Instead of jerusalem say alderaan, instead of God say The Spirit of Spotchka. Like it is so easy to come up with something else. As long as it remains unoffensive.

I can see this point in a multitude of cases, but need I remind you that the people found guilty of the saleem situation thought what they were doing wasn't offensive? This suggestion was actually something brooding in my mind for a while, since the saleem issue, some people, no names, continued to feel justified for a period of time after, beleiving they didn't actually break any rules just because one bad apple started to get into the offensive stereotype and rp suicide bombed or something. And im going to be totally honest. This server is not a very accepting environment to begin with, theres history of people getting bullied off over sexuality, gender, or even age. With the addition of bounty hunter, its only a matter of time until someone gets offended by a misrepresentation of their religion and then gets bullied off the server for having gotten offended. We, as a community, need to be better.

Common Sense varies person to person and is unreliable to be an enforced rule. +1 I think if its written down it clarifies things to others. I think this is the best way to avoid future issues.

I guess common sense disappeared from the minds of the people. Not really a needed suggestion at all. This Quote may be a good thing to add in: "In order to be able to think, you have to risk being offensive." Start policing everything that may be offensive or otherwise an impediment in some form or another and you risk ruining a lot more than you think. Freedom of creativity should never be shot down. Yeah sure Religions of the world fucking suck and create issues. But if you really want take up issue against religions, remember that Jedis and Sith are part of religions. Maybe don't include real world religion AS MUCH but don't be afraid to use some combination thereof for a good event.

IRL Religions = FailRP Not that hard to understand.

I'm going to agree with you saying that the majority of the things on the server are not "necessary" and are added to provide a better quality of life and overall appeal towards the server. Thank you for leaving your opinion again

I cannot see these models creating any RP whatsoever with any group. They're legit just the 2ndAC models but black... 2ndAC receiving jetpacks is a direct result of the inability to add any type of parachute to the server or anyways to effectively use them on the server. If 2ndAC didn't have jetpacks there would be almost no reason for having them. This is just a buff for the subunit to make them actually different then the mainline battalion and is one of the reasons the 212th decided to get rid of their Jet Trooper job. I've done the math and the 212th and 501st (Since that's who we are comparing) have the exact amount of jobs at 20 each. I'm also not saying anyone should lose anything because they have more than others however I know that both the 212th and 501st have more than everyone else is because they have triple the lore than everyone else. The 212th has a total of 28 models already whilst the 501st only has 20. This is entirely because you already have a set of different models for your mainline battalion and now you're asking for your other subunit to get two sets of models so that a fraction of the subunit can look different than the rest. I mean you guys already got three subunits and this just solidifies Parjai almost as their own subunit as well making it 4 which is way more than everyone else. For my third point I added that on because it's happened in the past. Not with 212th but with other groups. I also understand that the 212th has a lot of lore. Y'all are basically more or less the 7th Sky Corps since you have 2ndAC and Parjai however that doesn't justify a small group with an already small group getting non-accurate models and just because we have some lore inaccuracies doesn't mean we should keep adding onto that already huge list. Overall my entire argument is that this is a tiny group with a sub-unit. I don't see why they need extra models even if it's to stand out from the rest of their group. Not tryna hate or anything and I respect your opinions and willingness to talk this out like normal people unlike a lot of others so I appreciate it. I just am not a fan of this suggestion so I do apologize if that upsets any of you. I'm just a big nerd and a huge stickler for lore. Also I don't really see my mind being changed on the subject and would prefer for the sake of your suggestion that any further points be brought up in dms and not here on the Forums.

+1 bring back the pumpkin models

I'm going to say the same thing as last time too. I respect your opinion but I'm going to say a couple of things. I agree with your point with models don't make someone elite and I never said its what these are for. The models are there to drive rp within the group, battalion, and possibly the server at times. There's also nowhere saying 2ndAC has jetpacks. In fact, 2ndAC are paratroopers; however, due to server lag we don't get parachutes and we revolve around our jetpack usage. I will also say that the 1st point isn't entirely true to my understanding. I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure that 501st have more models and possibly more jobs than us. This isn't a bad thing at all and I'm not suggesting that they get rid of something. If someone wants a new job or model, it makes since, and they are excited about it I'm happy to see it being suggested and possibly added. With that being said, I appreciate your response again and would like to hear more back.

-1 I didn't support the last suggestion and I'm gonna stick with my original reasons as well. 1) 212th already has so much more in terms of jobs and models than every other battalion and group on the server. I do not believe a sub-unit within a sub-unit deserves their own models as they are not a server recognized group but rather a inner battalion group. 2) Parjai in lore looked exactly like the rest of 2ndAC. White and orange. I can understand wanting to make different designs on the armor instead of the generic two orange lines that 2ndAC have but making the armor black just doesn't fit in and is exactly why I -1'd the pumpkin Ghost Company models. 3) Models don't make groups elite. Once Parjai get's models, soon enough they will ask for jobs. If Parjai get these models more are gonna follow suit. Who's next, Foxtrot? Do they wanna be even more elite and have Night Ops armor? These models just aren't necessary and they don't follow lore or the 212th's uniform. Like I said I would much rather see different designs rather than black spec ops like armor. I also genuinely do not believe that a subunit of a subunit deserve their own models.

Politics & Religion are already topics which will get you told off or muted? I was under the impression this stuff was already covered under FailRP & Discrimination rules

+1 Models are sick. No reason not to. Unless of course it’s a ploy to take over the Czech Republic or something

1 minute is too much. The amount of ground I could cover in a minute is insane

wait so that means that when i get off LOA and fix my PC (Pray for my PC) i can't do any cult related encounters/events cuz it portrayes religions? damn rip some good ideas i had.

Yes. This is going in circles. Because I have to reexplain everything to each one of you apparently. 1. I'm not emotionally defending myself, I am drawing anecdotes to show how this is not a baseless rule. 2. What he did was not offensive but it was FailRP. 3. That quote was my signature, which I was not aware did not update as I had wished. 4. I do NOT care what you find funny. Keep it to yourself or to others that you KNOW will find it funny. Respect the fact that others may find your humor offensive. 5. This in no way sets the precedant you are claiming. In fact that makes no sense to me 6. I ALREADY ADDRESSED THAT TAKING INSPIRATION FROM A REAL WORLD RELIGION IS FINE BUT DO NOT FUCKING EMULATE OR MISREPRESENT IT. I said that in the original post. Quoted it, told you that in discord and said it in a post above. What this rule does is allow for an AOS before a problem occurs. Want to use religion? Then don't be a fucking dick and just get creative. Im done responding to stuff thats already been addressed. If you don't get it with any of my explanations then you don't get it. There is MORE than enough information here to justify this miniscule change.

Ok let me be more direct for the intellectually inept. USE FUCKING COMMON SENSE. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.