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Rancor BCMD try not to wipe ARC trainings challenge (IMPOSSIBLE) You say it's not a wipe but it is effectively a wipe. They need to do all the trainings except Selections which means it's basically just doing the whole new training. I don't see a difference except a larger frame of time to do it. This is a wipe and I think it's a bit dishonest to frame it as not being one. I also don't really see how this is much different, I dunno maybe I am insane but it sounds like more W&T with extra SIMs/Tests on top. I don't think anyone who goes through ARC training does it for the training, they do it for the job and you can pump the hours and time spend listening to some guy read off a doc but people don't go to trainings to learn shit. They go to trainings to be able to do stuff. maybe it will be more involved and interesting than some bloke just talking at you but I still don't think that gets rid of the underlying fact people do trainings for the reward, not to learn shit. This sounds like change for the sake of change, this doesn't seem to be addressing any of the actual issues I've heard people complain about it just seems to prolong the time for which people have to endure already very unpopular trainings hard -1 on the recerts, that is a wipe stop saying it's not I am undecided on the whole new system but I cannot see it ever making ARC troopers any better. It feels like any attempts at this from RANCOR will create more dislike towards ARC shit in general. so leaning -1 -1 on ARCT. Just let them pass the program then give em it. Seems completely pointless to award people before they've even finished Just a question, did you ask ARC from other battalions or people who are trained in general if they had criticisms of the system or even possible suggestions for improvement? It'd be nice to hear you talked to the community rather than made an idea purely from inside RANCOR hc.

-1 So, just so I'm not making a cookie-cutter response, I'm mainly putting in this vote simply because I'm against training wipes in general. I believe that at times you need to be reevaluated (something I would actually be open to do it if I, say got pulled aside for it) but to lose everything isn't really an ideal thought. I remember first time around I had my ARC training for years and Dennis' revamping of the trainings came around and (love you Dennis) it wasn't substantial whatsoever and the fail rate was just higher. I actually believe that some middle ground can be reached in this so it's not a repeat of what happened before. That being said, if it does come to me having to get recerted, I will actually go to the recerts. I just expect to learn something valuable and new because if I'm going to show up and relearn what bounding and ace reports are all over again, then it'll just make me wonder why I'm even there. Something that comes to mind and really worries me is that this is just going to turn into an overcomplicated version of what we have now regardless of the layout that this provided--the curriculum being vague and not necessarily giving us an idea of why we need two sets of trainings days and two different SIMs. I'm sure there are reasons, but I don't want a repeat of "NOT YOUR GRANDMA'S TECH TRAINING" to start applying to ARC. If I'm missing something please let me know so I can give a more educated response.

Just want to touch on this point. Currently, the 3 ARC Trainings we have create a roughly estimated time of 4 hours and 30min Maximum. These trainings, only add 10 minutes. For a total of 4 hours and 40 minutes. Not to mention this is more spread out, so people are sitting and waiting for 2 hours a day to complete trainings. On your previous point #3. Only 1 person is required to host Day 1,2,4,5. Then for Days 3 and 6, it requires a minimum of 2 people. This puts significantly less strain on Rancor to host as we don't need 4-5 members + staff every time. Hopefully this clears up some of your issues with this

I wouldn’t give permission to wipe arc trainings or do any forum of re-certification unless it passed a community suggestion. Changing just the training however is in full control of them so long as it doesn’t effect any currently trained members status.

People complain every time Med or Eng is wiped. This isn't because they hate change this is because they getting retrained for nothing. This is the big issue with the suggestion, people don't want it wiped because every wipe changed nothing and promises made here don't seem to be changing anything like that either. Yeah it's not the "end of the world" but it's just not preferable. No one is claiming it's the end of the server, this is just a lie lmao it's a public form, and he asked for opinions. If it's a useless change why would we support it? If it changes nothing but wipes a bunch of people why would the public be in favour of it. If the suggestion was open about the good reforms it was making people would probably easily support it. But it seems like another classic RANCOR wipe with no change at all. Extending the trainings would look good to us if they said what the contents would be. W&T seems to have been turned into 2 days but what are 3&4 there's no information I can see. It just seems all cosmetic, of course people are gonna oppose a wipe if it adds nothing. Everyone wants RANCOR to change and improve their training but this just doesn't seem to be fixing any of these issues

I'm 100% behind this change. For a long time ARC trainings have been in an awkward between place of being both 'elite' and useless, and this overhaul will make ARC trainings actually prevalent again. Also because I know it's a hot topic, ARC probably should be wiped. The fact that the proposed changes give everyone a month long period from when they start (NOTE THIS IS NOT 30 DAYS FROM THE DAY THE CHANGE STARTS, BUT 30 DAYS FROM WHEN YOU WALK UP TO A RANCOR OFFICER AND SAY "I'd like to start the recert process") should be an indicator that Rancor HC doesn't want everyone to lose their trainings. This isn't a Dennis wipe, so stop acting like it is. Stop acting like wipes are the end of the world, because they aren't. If you really care about the ARC program, get the trainings again and stop being lazy. Stop arguing just for the sake of arguing. -If you think this is a pointless change, then who cares, it's not gonna affect you. -If you think this is bad because people have to redo their trainings, then welcome to Synergy. Trainings and certifications get wiped all the time, this isn't some new concept, and it isn't the end of the world. Also love the usual trend of oldheads coming out of the fucking woodworks to stop anything from changing. Really helps make the community grow and change for the better.

Two different posts should have been made under a different section. One pertaining to the changes that are happening and one about voting for recertification's. This could have avoided confusion. -1 on recertification's. I don't see this as necessary to force everyone to redo something they have attained and still actively use. Nothing drastically is changing at it's core just the format is changing. If the format is changing why force a wipe? Unless a drastic core is changing on the server were everyone is going to re-learn something completely new (mechanics wise, drastic shift in gameplay style on the server, etc...) then it isn't needed. Questions: What is the end goal of this change? What kind of "ARC Troopers" are you trying to "produce" with these changes?

it really says a lot to me how you describe the purpose of ARC training, it being made to train anyone and everyone who desired it. That was the original vision for ARC training and I love how you're putting a focus on it. As of now, as much as it hurts me to say, ARC really is the most outdated training by a long shot. After all, the beginning stages started in 2016, hardly anything else has remained the same since then. An overhaul is long overdue. It seems like you've put a lot of thought into this. The ONLY thing that speaks out to me that I can't say I like is giving them the whitelist as an ARCT. I know I don't play anymore, but when I used to, the seeing someone on an ARC job during an event gave me two very useful consistent pieces of information (could make a huge difference in 1-lifes or large events). 1.) I know that they'll have similar firepower to me, I know their equipment. 2.) I know we will at least be somewhat on the same page assuming they remember the training, lets me know there are more communication options available. Allowing trainees will kinda ruin the second benefit, but like I said, unless it's a one-life event or something where I'm separated and looking for backup, it won't really change a lot. It's more of a comfort thing. +1 honestly dude no way to know if it'll work without trying. GOOD LUCK!!! If it ends up sucking, you can just revert back no big deal

classic gatekeeping. +1

I agree that changes should be made to the ARC trainings. Change is good. I don't agree with the recertifications. I just feel this is unneeded. +1 for revamping the ARC trainings. -1 for recertifications. I hope with the addition of ARCT again eARC can makes its return and when you fail you get eLiminated. I'll be here all night.

Look, if the recert doesn't pass then it doesn't pass. I'm not going to gripe on it or hate the people that didn't like it. It's up because community opinion matters when this kind of thing happens. As for the changes to the Training itself, if the Recert doesn't happen, it will have 0 effect on the people who are -1ing. If anything, the only people affected are Rancor SNCO+ and New ARCT. This was put up for an idea. This isn't a normal suggestion as this is going solely through directors. Again, if it doesn't happen it doesn't happen. I'm here to justify why it should, if the community says no, then it is what it is. We are trying, that's what matters to me.

This is funny. Alrighty my opinion is quite basic. As is, we host ARC trainings dominantly in EST based towards members in the Americas. EU times are neglected more cases then not. So wiping and moving trainings more spread out does nothing besides says we do something through out the week. That's the honest truth. Was to what we can change within the trainings I am for. I think Weapons and Tactics does neither of which it claims to train. Most of the tactics in the trainings are already taught outside of Rancor or are heavily outdated and or do not apply to Gmod AI. So for a rework of trainings I am for however I am against spreading them out since it offers no difference. Secondly, as for wiping the training. It will make no difference. We will get the same people with the trainings. All it does is say I reworked it on my description. Same goes for re-certs. Just a lazy wipe. People are more interested in passing then what is inside of the training. Now that is not everyone but that speaks for most of the server population. A good example is when we do re-certs. Looking at the test scores it shows most of them barely pass or don't know what we have down on our trainings. You know, I know. Conclusion. I personally want change to the trainings. I want to see them actually make people better at events so we can do harder events with more challenge that isn't more droids. So anything to move that forward I will always support. However, This change is not it. If I am honest this seems derived from experiences from other servers if I am honest. It also is long to be long. I would like to see a revise and my opinion might change however as it stands. -1 to Wiping ARC +1 to revise the Training.

We are still looking at community feedback, which is another reason the trianing changes are added in the post. I also referenced it in the quote below Look, I understand your issues with it, every single person would have to rerun this if they are ARC Trained. This also includes the people make the suggestion. We are under the same time frame as everyone. We are looking past the rose colored glasses and looking at the future of ARC and the future member of the ARC Program. We want to see new people be better than we were. We also want to make sure all ARCs are trained the same and uphold the standards we expect. We aren't looking at saving ourselves. This isn't for solo gain. This is for the betterment of ARC

I put the training changes in here so people would understand why a recert would be necessary. Not to vote on making the changes.

This could work, but if we were to add everything we want to into this one training, it would take 4 hours. @Fenrir

Best take imo, I didn’t see it as this very cool thing to have an animated pfp, but +1 if it has some kind of high yet achievable pre-requisite (If it was me, you would need high staff OR a very high post count with a net-positive rep)

Like I said on the last one if @Forseen is cool with it. I'm fine with trying it out and possibly setting some sort of restriction (IE you need some prerequisites, like a verified member or something to prevent file overload)

Unfortunately your ban appeal has been DENIED. For more information on why you were denied, please contact me or any Director+. // LOCKED // MOVED TO BAN APPEALS - DENIED

This is a very serious suggestion that we wish to make and hope that you, as the reader and community member, really read this before voting. That is all we ask. Disclaimer: When I say "We", this means Rancor High Command. Claw, Satan, Noodles, and myself. The topic I would like to bring to you today is about ARC Training and how it is being changed in the future. I will go through and explain how it is changing, and what possibilities can happen as a result of this change. Again, I really do hope you read this in it's entirety, as we are trying to make the ARC Program better as a whole, and not just trying to ruffle feathers for the sake of it. With that being said, thank you and let's begin. Name: Brooklyn RP Rank: XO Suggestion: We want to change ARC Trainings from what it currently is, a 3 staged tryout, to a 6 staged training that teaches and improves on the people who attend. I will explain this in detail. ARC Training Changes: To start, ARC Trainings as it stands right now is basically a tryout that upon passing gives you a permanent fallback on one of the best whitelists on the server. While the fallback itself wouldn't change, we want to change what the ARC Program is and move away from this tryout that don't really teach you things outside of the trainings itself. Weapons and Tactics is our only informational training that teaches you anything, with Selections and Leadership only being SIM's that are pass or fail with no incentive. We want to change ARC Training, or better said, ARC Tryouts, to be what it always should've been: A Program designed to better a players skills and ability, while teaching, mentoring, and improving on oneself without the limitations of no knowledge. This being said, I will give you a brief rundown as how this would work, without spoiling the contents of what the new trainings would consist of. You can only do 1 Day in a single day. Example: Day 1 - Monday / Day 2 - Tuesday / and so on and so forth. These do not have to be back to back days, you can go at your own pace. Selections will still be around to get people into the Program. Upon passing you will be granted ARCT. The ARCT Program will be talked about down below. Day 1 & 2 of this new program will consist of learning days. Day 1 being informational, and Day 2 being Basic Skill Training. These days are not failable, and instead is a time where you do it until you understand it. Day 1 takes around 20 minutes Day 2 takes around 1 hour Day 3 is your first knowledge and skills test. We will run you through a SIM that encompasses what you learned on Day 1 & 2. This Day is failable, however, instead of being stuck at this point, whatever you failed on, you will go back to. For example, if you failed on Day 1 Concepts, you will go back to Day 1, relearn what you might need, and then you can reattempt Day 3. Upon passing, you will move on. A concept we really want people to understand is we want to know you are listening, learning, and improving on what we are teaching you. This isn't to punish or make you do the same thing over and over, but again we want you to improve and get better as a player and as a future member of the ARC Program. Day 3 takes around 1 hour Day 4 & 5 are the same type of days as Day 1 & 2. These are not failable days that will obviously will have different concepts than the first 2 Days. Day 4 takes around 20 minutes Day 5 takes around 30 minutes Day 6 is your graduation Day. This Day is failable, but is also your final step to becoming a fully trained ARC Trooper. This training will encompass everything you learned from days 1-5. Upon passing, you will no longer be and ARCT. Again, this being a failable day, you would have to retake the course that you failed on for grading before you can retake Day 6. Day 6 takes about 1 hour and 30 minutes ARC Trainee (ARCT) Program: The ARCT Program was a concept that Rancor utilized a lot in 2017 - 2020, but has since then been phased out for not being needed. However, we intend to make this have purpose again. Let's get into what this ARCT Program will be. Obtained after Passing Selections The biggest change to the ARCT Program is this: Once you become an ARCT, you will have access to the ARC Whitelist right away. Upon passing Selections, you will have a 2 week time period to complete your ARC Trainings before losing access to the whitelist. (Please note this does not mean you have to restart your Trainings. This just means you get a free trial to be on ARC while you go through your Training Period.) When running around on the ARC whitelist as an ARCT. You must have ARCT in your name instead of ARC. While a ARCT you may not become a ARC Lore Character, attend Alpha Designations, or hold ARC Leadership in a battalion ARC Recertification: I know, I know, but bare with me here for a minute. This is not a Wipe. Again, I ask you read in full what this entails before making your judgement. This is how the ARC Recert will work: All ARC Trained individuals will have to go through the 6 Training Days to keep their ARC Training Current ARC Trained individuals will not have to retake Selections. Instead, they will start on Day 1. Unlike new ARCTs, ARCs who require recertification can run through as many days as needed in 1 day. For Example, I can complete Day 1-3 at one time. Upon completing Day 1. A 30 Day timer will begin. Should you not complete the 6 Trainings in that 30 Days, your trainings will be stripped. Failing Day 3 or Day 6 will not get your trainings removed. All you will have to do is redo what you failed on, and try again. Again, you can do as many in 1 Day at a time. These 30 Days do not start at the same time for everyone. They only start when you complete your Day 1. During this time period, you will not lose a lore character, ARCO/L Positions, or Alpha Designation. You will keep them until you pass Day 6 as long as the 30 Days does not expire. You can ask for time extensions. We know Real Life is a thing. If you cannot do this in the 2 weeks, you can contact Rancor Command for an extension. Rancor will actively pursue current ARC Slot Personnel, Lore Characters, and Alpha Designated Personnel as you will need it first to maintain your position. The only way to not pass is to be lazy or push it off. I'll be honest about that. This looks like a lot, but I will put your mind at ease. Reread the ARC Training Changes Section and look at the time it takes for each training. These are maximum times only, so they can take less time. Implementation: ARC Training Changes: These changes will be happening with ARC Regardless, the reason I wrote it all out is so you, as a community, can understand where we are coming from when we are literally revamping all of the ARC Program. This is not the voting topic. However we will look at any feedback you all give. ARC Trainee (ARCT) Program: Again, not the voting topic, but we will look into any feedback given on the topic. ARC Recertification: This is the voting topic. I know people who have been effected by an ARC Recert in the past most likely still has grudges against it, but I hope you read and understand why we want to make a change this big. That will be all. Thank you for reading and giving this idea a chance.

+1 As the current Shaak Ti I fully support the direction Rancor wishes to go in. I have complete trust that Rancors HC will be able to pull this off!

These aren't back to back? Its more spread out, which is one part I personally like of this idea. Keeps people's attention more easily without tiring them out. Also the suggestion is more focused on wiping the training, not so much the change. While they do want feedback on the changes please keep your vote directed at the wipe. Thanks.

Yeah... so being serious from time to time is fine. But expecting 6hrs+? We can't even get serious 1hr deployments most of the time. I got yelled at as Keller and Bacara for having too long and too serious of KU tryouts. The want for ARC slots would drop drastically if this came out.

I am going to remain mostly impartial for the time being, but the entire player base does not need to be ARC trained. These trainings would be for those who seek the more serious aspects of the server and wish to be a staple of the server, not everyone needs to go through these, it is a choice. Read the above statement, if you don't want that serious experience and want to play for the relaxed aspect of the server... Don't go to the trainings?

Look at one point I'd probably of 100% agreed with y'all and honestly these trainings would be dope for a much more serious server or hell an Arma server maybe. But this is garry's mod, and a very relaxed server. I've thought that ARC trainings are flawed and need revamping but this is going very overboard and I don't think fits within the archetype that the server is trynna fit into. -1

-1 No. 6+ hours for a week of training? Terrible. 1. The timeline is WAAAAAAY too long and that's assuming you don't fail anything. 2. You gonna host it all by yourself? Cause you are gonna need your Rancor guys to host it and you already have a hard enough time getting people to run current ARC trainings from time to time. 3. This is way beyond what serious level of play that the current player base would want. 4. Just change up W/T and Leadership a bit if you feel that there should be more taught during both.

Name: cat Steam ID: to lazy Ban Reason: idfk Date of Ban: 3 months ago Length of Ban: perma Staff Member(s) Involved: idk Reason(s) why we should accept your appeal: bc i wanna g et on a server i havent been on in a while and i have no other gmod servers to play and ill happily change and i wont be a minge this time ill become a better person that will join a battalion get some promotions and work my way up Evidence to support your claims: no

+1 TBH. I think ARC trainings really have needed to be more helpful than they are. At first I said no because I didn't want to have to do Recerts. The only issue I have is the 30 day period to get the recertified after you do Day 1. I am just a little confused why that was decided. If that could be cleared up it would help me support this even more.

The point of a suggestion is to get a specific idea added to the server. Making the actual contents of the suggestion happens before you make the post. The idea is usually finished when the post is made. You should ask people. there's a reason similar suggestions cannot be posted within 60 days of each other, it's because once you make a suggestion you get the community to vote on this idea and this idea only. This is not a feedback forum, this is asking the community if they want this idea added. I think it probably would've been smarter to make a general post about changes to ARC and feedback since it's not something the community has the right to vote on. Then once that was sorted make a suggestion about doing the wipe. Cause you're mixing the wipe suggestion and changes feedback

I may of not caught this in the string of messages within this thread, but I am quite confused. This is, what appears to be, a 2 part suggestion. In which both parts are things that Rancor HC can do without a suggestion? I think the biggest issue that the community faces when it comes to a change like this is simple, but there are no guarantees that a new ARC training system will work, as this training isn’t viewable to the public, yet effects all those who currently, or will eventually receive it. I’m not going to write out an MLA formatted document essay to say I don’t want my training wiped, cause I don’t. Call it selfish, or ignorant, or conservative, I honestly don’t care lmao. I encourage Rancor HC to make any and all changes to ARC as they want. At the end of the day, Synergy is built on backwards development. It seems like we don’t learn from previous changes / mistakes. I pray to Joah that this would be the final and everlasting, completely encompassing change… but I don’t believe that. good luck -1

-1 this will screw over a lot of people who cant make the times or don't have the time to attend these. Its hard enough to get someone to host selections, leadership, W&T as is during off times, lets not make it more of a pain in the rear for those who cant make the times to get what they need. The current system works fine, if youre concerned about people not passing any of the steps, then help them then and there to improve then give them another chance to make an attempt.